The Ukraine situation is more complex. Eastern Ukrainians had their (overwhelmingly supported) president ousted in a Western-supported coup, then their language banned, then spent 8 years getting artillery shelled by Western Ukraine, the two peace agreements signed (by Zelenskyy who was elected on a peace platform) were then ignored by Ukraine largely because it would’ve let them vote on self-determination, then increasing talk of bringing in Western military support to crush the rebels (and consequently set up NATO bases next to Russia), then the parliamentary parties they support got banned, and so on.
So let’s not count Russia’s invasion and annexation as entirely unwanted by all East Ukrainians (or entirely unavoidable by Ukraine itself without very minor concessions). They have been utterly and undemocratically fucked over by Ukraine proper for over a decade. Ukraine didn’t entirely not choose this path, admittedly with scary Western pressure.
This doesn’t justify Russia’s actions, but let’s dismiss the myth that the war is borne entirely of some random desire to conquer by Putin, there are some very real factors and unnecessary suffering caused by Ukraine that preceded invasion. If Russia hadn’t invaded, we’d be seeing Ukraine, Azov, western arms and armies marching into the DPR/LPR and mass murdering plenty civilians, continuing to mass-oppress them, and setting up military bases there.
There’s more to be said about the worrying amount of Nazism, white supremacy, and anti-communism of the Ukrainian government, (see for example the UN votes on food rights and banning Nazi symbols, the US, Israel and Ukraine were basically the only ones to vote against). But these are the main points.
No war but class war, Russia 100% sucks, NATO 100% sucks, they’re both fascist, capitalist, and fucked up. Of the two options, it’s better for the stronger, wider, ‘more imperialist’ NATO/US Hegemony to lose instead of win.
Obviously the best outcome for leftists (and people in general) is for Russia and NATO to both equally lose and explode, but that’s just unlikely. So when we don’t want to emphatically chant for Russia’s loss, it’s just about the lesser of two evils.
Here is the referenced comment:
The Ukraine situation is more complex. Eastern Ukrainians had their (overwhelmingly supported) president ousted in a Western-supported coup, then their language banned, then spent 8 years getting artillery shelled by Western Ukraine, the two peace agreements signed (by Zelenskyy who was elected on a peace platform) were then ignored by Ukraine largely because it would’ve let them vote on self-determination, then increasing talk of bringing in Western military support to crush the rebels (and consequently set up NATO bases next to Russia), then the parliamentary parties they support got banned, and so on.
So let’s not count Russia’s invasion and annexation as entirely unwanted by all East Ukrainians (or entirely unavoidable by Ukraine itself without very minor concessions). They have been utterly and undemocratically fucked over by Ukraine proper for over a decade. Ukraine didn’t entirely not choose this path, admittedly with scary Western pressure.
This doesn’t justify Russia’s actions, but let’s dismiss the myth that the war is borne entirely of some random desire to conquer by Putin, there are some very real factors and unnecessary suffering caused by Ukraine that preceded invasion. If Russia hadn’t invaded, we’d be seeing Ukraine, Azov, western arms and armies marching into the DPR/LPR and mass murdering plenty civilians, continuing to mass-oppress them, and setting up military bases there.
There’s more to be said about the worrying amount of Nazism, white supremacy, and anti-communism of the Ukrainian government, (see for example the UN votes on food rights and banning Nazi symbols, the US, Israel and Ukraine were basically the only ones to vote against). But these are the main points.
No war but class war, Russia 100% sucks, NATO 100% sucks, they’re both fascist, capitalist, and fucked up. Of the two options, it’s better for the stronger, wider, ‘more imperialist’ NATO/US Hegemony to lose instead of win.
Obviously the best outcome for leftists (and people in general) is for Russia and NATO to both equally lose and explode, but that’s just unlikely. So when we don’t want to emphatically chant for Russia’s loss, it’s just about the lesser of two evils.
TL;DR: This meme from China: https://i.redd.it/nmi09294y5ub1.jpg